Tokai article in Guitar & Bass magazine

[Nani]

Nothing wrong with having a lot of guitars if you enjoy them, my basic thought is...

Now that the ST-80 costs twice as much to buy as it did a couple of years ago, it's not twice as good a guitar as it used to be.

I think expectations may get out of hand, just as the price gets out of hand. And with more people inspired to seek them out by articles, the price will surely go up

 

[villager]

Now that the ST-80 costs twice as much to buy as it did a couple of years ago, it's not twice as good a guitar as it used to be.

but nowadays there are half as many available..

so theres a rarity factor too.

 

[Rossi]

Hi villager.Seeing as you have more experience than most of us in selling Tokai guitars i will aim this question at you.

As you know ive bought a couple of guitars off you over a 2/3 year period and ive not seen them double in price one was a 81 LS-80 for ?600/ ?700 i think it was that price 2 years ago,and ive not seen any for sale at ?1400 at this moment in time,in fact ?700 would still buy you one today.I think the 7okai ST-80s and above Springys are fetching more because like you said,they are a good guitar,people are now finding out more about them,so demand is putting the price up.more that sell the rarer they get and people will still want them.

So you will know how much the prices have gone up,i would and a lot of others would like to know just by how much,and what do you think now,are the prices stable.

I ask you these questions because as you know i trust you 100%

 

[villager]

doubled is an exaggeration ..probably gone up 20-30% in 2 years, depending on the model... price depends on price in Japan..they set the market price not me..and there are less and less and people in japan are paying more and more, so i see no levelling out just yet...

but i could be totally wrong about that...

there are certainly less high end guitars and more people wanting them though..

 

[kmarccoco]

I am not a collector, and have bought mine to play.. The reason I'll pay $1,500 for a vintage springy, is because they are twice the guitar as the new fender strats, in my opinion, and also better than the custom shop relics.. Not to mention that a 1979 springy is almost 30 years old and truely vintage..

As a matter of fact, the sales people at Guitar Center, when they played mine, even said that they were "way better than the relics"(although, I have played some relics that were pretty nice). All but one salesman have never even heard of 7okai.

I would guess that as people start to learn about them, they will stay in demand.

 

[Anonymous]

The new Fender Custom Shop stuff varies a lot - some of them are very average guitars, a few are very good. But they're new. A guitar that's 20 to 30 years old (assuming it was decent in the first place) will have acquired character that a shiny new guitar doesn't have. Long before a guitar wears out, it wears in.

And 80s stuff is now older than the 60s stuff was when the "vintage is better" opinions first started to be heard in the mid to late 70s. So an 80s guitar is a genuine vintage instrument.

 

[Peter Mac]

Hi guys,

the pricing on older Tokais does certainly seem to vary. There is no denying that the 80-series up for both Springy and LP certainly escalate disproportionately to the original price but then so do the originals.
The 40 - 70 series seem to stay more stable - which is a good thing as there were certainly more of these models made.
One thing most people dont take into account is the bare strip of wood used to place the color code. In the absence of N/C laquer, this bare strip and the neck pocket allowed the wood to breathe and mature under the poly laquer. If you refinished an ST-50 in N/C the wood would sing almost every bit as sweet as the ST-80 due to this one small feature.
I bought my 82 Springy ST-65 MB brand new in 1984 - when i open the case i get that wonderful old wood smell - "Essence of Alder" It really inspires me to grab the neck and play, ya know.
It is a little similar to 'Antaes' by Chanel.

regards
Peter Mac

 

[Peter Mac]

Hi Mike,

I do have a copy of Andrew's original draft should you want to read it and you can't wait until May 23rd. - No Pictures though
Thing is I cannot say if it has been altered or not prior to publication.

regards
Peter Mac

 

[Nani]

Yes, post it if you can. I'd like to see it.

 

[Anonymous]

If you refinished an ST-50 in N/C the wood would sing almost every bit as sweet as the ST-80 due to this one small feature.

As it's a player, with possibly a replaced decal (the magazine people didn't seem very interested in it!), I have been tempted to get the back of the neck of my white Goldstar ST50 re-finished in nitro. I'm sure it would make it feel better. But I don't like the idea of messing with a guitar that will be 25 next year, so I probably won't.

As for the article, thanks Peter, but I'll wait until it comes out. If there's anything contentious in it, it's the people on here I will want to discuss it with, & there's not much point if only you and me have read it! I appreciate the offer though.

By the way, when will we be able to buy your book?

 

[Anonymous]

I received the CD of pics from the magazine today, & you can see them here:

http://s183.photobucket.com/albums/x153/stratman323/Tokais%20Guitar%20mag%200408/?start=0

I believe that the magazine is due out tomorrow. I thought I might have been sent an advance copy or two, but that hasn't happened (yet).

 

[Nani]

Thanks for sharing the photos. You have some nice guitars.

That's a very curious choice of backgrounds for the pictures. The red is very prominent and seems to distort the colors of the guitars as well.

 

[Anonymous]

Yes, you're right. In the pic of the two Sunburst Springys, they both look like 3 tone (with red), whereas the ST60 (behind) is 3 tone, while the ST80 is actually 2 tone (no red). As the ash grain is more prominent on the ST60, I would have put that at the front.

I think that the filters they had on the lights were more of a factor than the background. I seem to recall that they were using red filters on the lights at some point.

It's interesting that they had the same problem that I do with taking pics of the dark metallic green Goldstar ST55 - if you expose for the correct green tone, the white bits looks washed out. However if you expose for the white, the green darkens into black.

 

[cheshirecatsmile]

Nice looking guitars Mike!

I especially like the metallic green--that's a rare finish, and a beautiful colour for a guitar! Looking forward to the article...

________
Marijuana Hemp

 

[amunro]

Hi all, sorry I've haven't been back on this site for a little while. It is my article and I've just dropped an email to Peter Mac asking for his address to send him a copy of the magazine. As far as I can see, it's the same text as I wrote although the title and header are different. I'm happy for the article to be posted up on the site, I've got to say it looks great with the pics of Mike's guitars - regardless of how it reads. I'm not sure it holds much which the gurus on this site won't already know but I hope you enjoy it.

Andrew

 

[Nani]

Yes, you're right. In the pic of the two Sunburst Springys, they both look like 3 tone (with red), whereas the ST60 (behind) is 3 tone, while the ST80 is actually 2 tone (no red). As the ash grain is more prominent on the ST60, I would have put that at the front.

True, the reds are very saturated, perhaps due to the background color. The background is also in fairly sharp focus, and very textured, which is distracting.

 

[Anonymous]

I received my two free copies of the magazine yesterday, & I have to say I'm rather impressed with the article. OK, it didn't teach me much, but it wasn't intended to, it's supposed to be general background and an introduction to Tokais. It does this job very well.

The style of writing appeals to me - it manages to explain some quite technical details without becoming too "nerdy", and that isn't as easy as it sounds. It was interesting to read about the advantage that not signing the CITES treaty gave to the Japanese between 74 & 80 - I hadn't heard about that before.

So, well done Andrew, & of course, Peter Mac. 8)

A couple of minor queries or corrections:

The opening paragraph (presumably not written by Andrew) is wrong - the metallic green beast is a Goldie, not a Springy.

Was the Springy introduced in 1977? I thought it was 1978?

A very minor point this, but the article states that the Goldstar decal was "a gold lettered script that couldn't be mistaken the famous Fender one". True, the script was not the same as the more common spaghetti logo, but it was quite similar to the 1964 to 67 transition decal:

Admittedly this is a minor point, but I think it's interesting that it's commonly overlooked.

Although I don't wish to blow my own trumpet, I do think that the pics of my guitars helped the article a lot. The accurately captioned detailed pics really prove the point that the article makes about what nice Strats these are, so I'm glad I made the effort to battle through the London traffic. And I'll even forgive the editor for calling me Mark Davies in his editorial!

If only I had as many Tokais as that bloke who is called Mark......

 

[Rossi]

Yes a very good write up Mark :wink:

 

[amunro]

Stratman, in answer to your various points; the comment about the green Goldstar was not mine (I wrote the articel back in October/November) I guess it was an editorial slip. As regards the logo, that was my bad. To be honest, I had never considered the similarity before. As regards the introduction year, I'm open to persuasion, I thought 77 but I may be wrong.

I think the pictures are great - you have a fine collection and the article looks fantastic as a result.

Andrew

 

[Anonymous]

And the forum got a plug too, which I think is important. 8)

I'm selling the Springy ST60 that can be seen in the article - details here:

http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=72108#72108