Greco Super Sound
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If it's not some kind of parts guitar and the neckplate and serial are original, it would kind of have to be an SE-800S. It was the only model with a pre-CBS headstock and Rotomatic-type tuners at the time.
What's unusual is the rosewood neck. It's not an official catalog option for the -800 in 1977. But that certainly doesn't mean there weren't any made, I've seen plenty of examples of otherwise 50's-styled guitars with rosewood fretboards. The original pickguard for this guitar would have been single-ply with 8 screws.
But let it be known that Greco SE's are a confusing bunch generally. There were numerous small changes made to the various models year by year, quite diffucult to keep track of, and they also ran what was presumably the world's first custom shop(ish) operation, starting as early as in 1972. If odd guitars are not non-documented production-line variations, chances are that they either part of a small batch ordered by some store or smaller distributor or a custom order by an end-user. The fun just never stops.
What's unusual is the rosewood neck. It's not an official catalog option for the -800 in 1977. But that certainly doesn't mean there weren't any made, I've seen plenty of examples of otherwise 50's-styled guitars with rosewood fretboards. The original pickguard for this guitar would have been single-ply with 8 screws.
But let it be known that Greco SE's are a confusing bunch generally. There were numerous small changes made to the various models year by year, quite diffucult to keep track of, and they also ran what was presumably the world's first custom shop(ish) operation, starting as early as in 1972. If odd guitars are not non-documented production-line variations, chances are that they either part of a small batch ordered by some store or smaller distributor or a custom order by an end-user. The fun just never stops.
Well, the SE-800J is a special case, an artist model based on a guitar played by Jeff Beck during a incredibly hyped 1978 tour of Japan with Stanley Clarke. And it seems like everyone wanted a guitar just like the original, they're all white, have pickup switching using three mini-toggles and a black single-ply scratchplate. The catalog page you posted is from 1979 (either from Vol 10, the main one, or the "1979 Special" edition) and it can't really be any earlier given the timing of the Beck tour.
If your guitar had had a 1979 serial, SE-600 would have been another option, by that time that model came with small headstock and Klusons as well. There's a constant "feature creep" going on over time, so something that is unique for one model one year might turn up in one or two lower models the following year.
But like I said, to have a unofficial rosewood fretboard option for a guitar with otherwise 1950s'appointment is certainly not unknown. Here's one I had myself, a March 1981 SE-500T, basically a copy of a mid-50's Strat, only with an anachronistic rw board. Seems a bit weird by moderns standards perhaps, but the basic concept of detail-correct copies of specific vintages was actually in the process of being invented (by Tokai) at about the same time as your guitar was manufactured. Different time, differen place.
If your guitar had had a 1979 serial, SE-600 would have been another option, by that time that model came with small headstock and Klusons as well. There's a constant "feature creep" going on over time, so something that is unique for one model one year might turn up in one or two lower models the following year.
But like I said, to have a unofficial rosewood fretboard option for a guitar with otherwise 1950s'appointment is certainly not unknown. Here's one I had myself, a March 1981 SE-500T, basically a copy of a mid-50's Strat, only with an anachronistic rw board. Seems a bit weird by moderns standards perhaps, but the basic concept of detail-correct copies of specific vintages was actually in the process of being invented (by Tokai) at about the same time as your guitar was manufactured. Different time, differen place.
I didnt mean the jeff beck model. If you look closely you see in the left bottom that the SE800 also has a rose fretboard option. But seems to be a lot of mysterys indeed at the that time with the grecos. Here also a picture of the pickups
Aha, I see, I missed that, the screen dump wasn't all that readable. But yeah, I'm pretty sure there was in fact a rosewood option in 1977, even if it wasn't in the catalog.
The body looks all-good as a pre-1980 Greco in terms of the routs, but the pickups appears to be later. They're certainly Greco SE pickups, but in 1977, they should have the embossed "Excel" logo, but not the 31276 parts number (or whatever it is) and a dark grey lead. Any idea if the seller still has the original 'guard? It should have had a date stamp between the neck and middle pickup holes.
Any markings on the pots? Can't see much of the harness, but I don't think it's fully original.
The body looks all-good as a pre-1980 Greco in terms of the routs, but the pickups appears to be later. They're certainly Greco SE pickups, but in 1977, they should have the embossed "Excel" logo, but not the 31276 parts number (or whatever it is) and a dark grey lead. Any idea if the seller still has the original 'guard? It should have had a date stamp between the neck and middle pickup holes.
Any markings on the pots? Can't see much of the harness, but I don't think it's fully original.
Okay so when did they start with only the 31276 marking?
For example here is one from 1978 wich has the same pickups.
https://reverb.com/item/78212789-greco-se800-super-sound-1978-tobacco-sunburst-fujigen
For example here is one from 1978 wich has the same pickups.
https://reverb.com/item/78212789-greco-se800-super-sound-1978-tobacco-sunburst-fujigen
I know nothing about these, but I did find this listing on Reverb in Indonesia.
Maxon 31276 Stratocaster Guitar Pickup Excel PU-119 Greco SE-700 Lawsuit Era MIJ Fender Japan
vintage pickup from the 1970s for Strat, Maxon model 31276. I've seen Maxon pickups with both 31276 and Excel engraved, Excel engraved only, 31276 engraved only, and no engraved. all very similar both in material, specs, and sounds. this one has only 31276 engraved on bottom flatwork and 31276 on the inside part of the cover. one difference I noticed, the 31276 has typical 52mm poles spacing while the other has narrower 50mm. read around 6k on my old Fluke meter. pickup only with its original aged cover, no mounting hardware (I've tapped the screws holes to imperial 6-32 so you can use typical mouting screws, the original screws was smaller metric size).
Maxon 31276 Stratocaster Guitar Pickup Excel PU-119 Greco SE-700 Lawsuit Era MIJ Fender Japan
vintage pickup from the 1970s for Strat, Maxon model 31276. I've seen Maxon pickups with both 31276 and Excel engraved, Excel engraved only, 31276 engraved only, and no engraved. all very similar both in material, specs, and sounds. this one has only 31276 engraved on bottom flatwork and 31276 on the inside part of the cover. one difference I noticed, the 31276 has typical 52mm poles spacing while the other has narrower 50mm. read around 6k on my old Fluke meter. pickup only with its original aged cover, no mounting hardware (I've tapped the screws holes to imperial 6-32 so you can use typical mouting screws, the original screws was smaller metric size).
Attachments
1977 catalog
•The idea of the project series
Have you ever had an experience like this? 'I wanted to make it custom-made, but I was told it would be expensive," or "I could make it, but I couldn't make a new tremolo." A devastating and unsatisfactory reply... •*•
The project series is a new form of made-to-order guitars that cannot be perfectly copied or are too expensive to make, as well as guitars that cannot be repaired with minor changes. It's a series. Guitars that cannot be made to order, such as old guitars or new models from other companies, or models with changed colors or parts, can be made perfectly using the Project Series, and at a lower price than custom- made guitars.
•Features of the project series
1) The project series is a "build-to-order" style in which we recruit applicants for the course, accept orders, and produce. We decide what kind of guitar to make based on the situation, such as letters and inquiries from users, or if- there are many orders for the same model in our made-to-order system.
2) In the project series, the guitar is placed in a birch silicone cloth and then stored in a special case, as shown in the photo on the left. Please always take good care of your guitar and use it for a lifetime. Service from Greco to the owner.
3) All guitars with the project series name come with a special hard case. The special case has a "Faultless Case" plate attached. The landmark is a gold plate.
4) Project Series guitars come with a lifetime warranty. Greco will repair or adjust the product free of charge to the original owner if there is a manufacturing defect on the part of Greco.
•The idea of the project series
Have you ever had an experience like this? 'I wanted to make it custom-made, but I was told it would be expensive," or "I could make it, but I couldn't make a new tremolo." A devastating and unsatisfactory reply... •*•
The project series is a new form of made-to-order guitars that cannot be perfectly copied or are too expensive to make, as well as guitars that cannot be repaired with minor changes. It's a series. Guitars that cannot be made to order, such as old guitars or new models from other companies, or models with changed colors or parts, can be made perfectly using the Project Series, and at a lower price than custom- made guitars.
•Features of the project series
1) The project series is a "build-to-order" style in which we recruit applicants for the course, accept orders, and produce. We decide what kind of guitar to make based on the situation, such as letters and inquiries from users, or if- there are many orders for the same model in our made-to-order system.
2) In the project series, the guitar is placed in a birch silicone cloth and then stored in a special case, as shown in the photo on the left. Please always take good care of your guitar and use it for a lifetime. Service from Greco to the owner.
3) All guitars with the project series name come with a special hard case. The special case has a "Faultless Case" plate attached. The landmark is a gold plate.
4) Project Series guitars come with a lifetime warranty. Greco will repair or adjust the product free of charge to the original owner if there is a manufacturing defect on the part of Greco.
Attachments
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And the 31276 marked pickups may be the same as Excel pickups if you believe what the Reverb post quoted above said. He said he has seen them marked Excel and 31276 on the same pickup.
Tricky. If I read the date stamp on the pickguard correctly, it's 200205 right? That's February 5th 1980, which syncs well with the pickups but less so with the neckplate serial and the pup rout shapes (they began using the more rounded vintage Fender style in 1980). That's an obvious anachronism, and I personally doubt that the guitar left the factory with those pickups installed. I mean, all the custom options on offer could easily explain the other irregularities, but the pickguard date is an obvious mod indicator. Any codes on the pots?
And yeah @Sigmania, like the seller you linked to says, the Excel only pickups have a slightly narrower pole pitch that Fender standard. The original narrow ones are designated PU-100 (once pickups designations come in, in 1976 IIRC), the wider-pitch PU-119s are introduced on the SE-700 in 1977, and to keep things interesting, there is a version of PU-100 with a wider pole pitch (the PU-100W) as well. As far as I know, the latters only appearance in a catalog model is in the 1979 version of the SE500, but lord knows I might have missed one...
By 1980, the whole designations system goes out the window, they're now PU-S3s (low-end ceramics), PU-S5s and S8s, both the latter being Excel-based alnicos, but by now all are 31276 only. Slightly later in the game ), they get 31276 on the top bobbin too, as well as on the inside of the pup covers. Pickups with both Excel and 31276 seems to be 1979 only and I can't say wether or not they're all narrow-pitch.
Anyway, the narrower pole pitch is mirrored in the width of the bridge saddles on guitars that came stock with PU-100s, which is 10-10,5 mm (the roughly cast saddled vary a bit) instead of the 11,3 mm Fender standard used on guitars that came with the wider spacing. Hard to be sure, but it looks like the original bridge might have the narrower saddles?
The1978 version of the SE-800 had PU-100 pickups, so original pickups would almost certainly have the Excel logo. Also the guitar you linked to has a non-original pickguard. Grecos never came with mint guards (I don't think any MIJ strats from this period did), and the original for this one would have been a single ply white guard, often faded to beige by now, so it's definitely been tampered with. The -700 came with PU-119s, so those are likely to be originals. The -700 is a very different guitar though, with a CBS headstock with (weirdly) "Early Sixties" on it.
And yeah @Sigmania, like the seller you linked to says, the Excel only pickups have a slightly narrower pole pitch that Fender standard. The original narrow ones are designated PU-100 (once pickups designations come in, in 1976 IIRC), the wider-pitch PU-119s are introduced on the SE-700 in 1977, and to keep things interesting, there is a version of PU-100 with a wider pole pitch (the PU-100W) as well. As far as I know, the latters only appearance in a catalog model is in the 1979 version of the SE500, but lord knows I might have missed one...
By 1980, the whole designations system goes out the window, they're now PU-S3s (low-end ceramics), PU-S5s and S8s, both the latter being Excel-based alnicos, but by now all are 31276 only. Slightly later in the game ), they get 31276 on the top bobbin too, as well as on the inside of the pup covers. Pickups with both Excel and 31276 seems to be 1979 only and I can't say wether or not they're all narrow-pitch. Anyway, the narrower pole pitch is mirrored in the width of the bridge saddles on guitars that came stock with PU-100s, which is 10-10,5 mm (the roughly cast saddled vary a bit) instead of the 11,3 mm Fender standard used on guitars that came with the wider spacing. Hard to be sure, but it looks like the original bridge might have the narrower saddles?
The1978 version of the SE-800 had PU-100 pickups, so original pickups would almost certainly have the Excel logo. Also the guitar you linked to has a non-original pickguard. Grecos never came with mint guards (I don't think any MIJ strats from this period did), and the original for this one would have been a single ply white guard, often faded to beige by now, so it's definitely been tampered with. The -700 came with PU-119s, so those are likely to be originals. The -700 is a very different guitar though, with a CBS headstock with (weirdly) "Early Sixties" on it.
