Strat numbering since February 1, 1982 and x=y

Area for Tokai's older than 1985

Moderators: ian, ned

Daizo
Sus4add11
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 5:58 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Contact:

Post by Daizo » Thu Apr 28, 2005 5:34 pm

I have not heard from Tokai nor a guy who wrote Tokai Strat book. Will push them a bit.

Japanese calender year goes like this ;

1978 = Showa Year 53
1979 = Showa Year 54
:
:
1988 = Showa Year 63
1989 = Heisei Year 1
1990 = Heisei Year 2
1991 = Heisei Year 3

"3" may mean 1978, 1988 or 1991 ... ????
Then how can we explain the pattern like 6-11, 12=11 etc.
Daizo

sneakyjapan
Guitar God
Posts: 1871
Joined: Mon May 12, 2003 9:56 pm

Post by sneakyjapan » Thu Apr 28, 2005 6:44 pm

golden week... nobody home.

Daizo
Sus4add11
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 5:58 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Contact:

Post by Daizo » Thu Apr 28, 2005 8:13 pm

:):) I am home :):) I just learned that the longest traffic jam on May 3 will be for 55km (more than 30 miles) on a certain highway !

Being at home sometimes brings luck. 14 minutes ago, I received an e-mail from the kind editor of Japan Vintage No.2.

He has seen 6=2A, 4=11, 4=12, 12=2, and 7=11 among guitars used for the magazine. There are no latter numbers being more than 12, he points out.

However, Fernandes large head guitar (of course made by Tokai in 1978) had F6=37, he said. I think this belongs to a different category.

While he does not know the exact mechanism of numbering, he estimates that the latter number may show production month because some has 4=11 on its body and 4=12 on neck butt - probably one month difference. Another example he found is 6-8 body and 6-6 neck - two months lag is quite likely.

He did not pay much attention to those numbers, but will do so and wants to exchange information going forward, his mail said.

Then, what does 12 of "12-11" mean ?? Production line in the factory ??

My survey to continue ...
Daizo

20 century boy
Guitar God
Posts: 1091
Joined: Tue May 06, 2003 1:45 pm
Location: Paris

Post by 20 century boy » Fri Apr 29, 2005 12:08 am

It's like a detective novel ! :P
thanks for inquiring, it's nice to follow.

(my silver star number is : 3036858)
nankurunai sa!

ian
Guitar God
Posts: 834
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:46 am
Location: London

Post by ian » Fri Apr 29, 2005 2:20 am

According to this link, Sneaky was once told by president of Tokai that code was ?Month = Production No.?, eg 4=8 means April and production code 8. Seems strange though (& not sure Sneaky believed the guy either), because month doesn?t seem to help anyone much without the year (neither us nor Tokai factory) http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php ... d&start=15

The fact that we ?never? see numbers above 12 does suggest it?s a straightforward month number, but that could be just a coincidence of course (& seems both numbers go from 1 to 12!?).

If it doesn?t match the Japanese calendar I?m inclined to think whole thing may just be a production code for tracking the work of differnt producuction teams or differnt areas of the factory. They used to do same thing in the UK Staffordshire Pottery industries, ie many people were on so-called ?Piece Work?, ie paid by the number of pieces they produced ? they marked each piece with their initials or a symbol & were paid according to how much they did (but not paid for any sub-standard pieces).

Ian.

sneakyjapan
Guitar God
Posts: 1871
Joined: Mon May 12, 2003 9:56 pm

Post by sneakyjapan » Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:19 am

never thought to do a search on that thread... I`d forgoten about what was sent to me in that e-mail. Good work.

ned
Guitar God
Posts: 1180
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2001 6:00 pm
Location: Austin, TX
Contact:

Post by ned » Sat Apr 30, 2005 9:47 am

This is good stuff. Daizo see if you can get the editors to join the forum!!!

Ian, actually was getting into the Spain conversation you and Luis were having. I just finished reading Iberia by Mitchner. Maybe we should start a thread in Off Topic on great places to shop for guitars in different countries/states/provinces.

ian
Guitar God
Posts: 834
Joined: Wed Aug 13, 2003 11:46 am
Location: London

Post by ian » Sat Apr 30, 2005 10:28 am

Ned ... unfortunately everywhere in UK is vastly overpriced compared to US, eg some interesting shops in central London (Denmark St. is famous for it) but best just to look & try (keep your $ firmly in your wallet) :( . There?s an interesting repair/luthier shop near me in Kingston (that's south-west London ? easily the nicest part of London for anyone visiting (forget the major tourist trail of West End) but apart from doing a good setup etc. the shop is also stacked with old Gibson/Fender/Guild guitars plus dozens of ancient Marshall, Vox, Orange. Hi-watt amps etc :-? .

Ian.

Daizo
Sus4add11
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 5:58 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Contact:

Post by Daizo » Sat Apr 30, 2005 10:30 am

Just received a response from the business development department of
Tokai Guitar. They sound a bit reserved saying "there are not many
people remaining familiar with old models."

I need to explain why I would like to visit their factory :)

Will see ...
Daizo

syrinx
Plucker
Posts: 12
Joined: Sat Feb 14, 2004 1:18 pm

Post by syrinx » Sat Apr 30, 2005 12:37 pm

you might point out to them that your studies are to benifit the people who have supported them throughout. The fact of the matter is, if tokai could "get into" the american market in a big way they would prosper as they have always desired. The information you posses of this focus group is as important to them as the dating and numbering is to us. I still wonder as voiced in my silverstar thread if some of these markings are from outsource parts. Another thing when it comes to numbering- in manufacture it is much more normal to use week#s instead of month- unless you have very limited production-or no quality control.

20 century boy
Guitar God
Posts: 1091
Joined: Tue May 06, 2003 1:45 pm
Location: Paris

Post by 20 century boy » Sat Apr 30, 2005 2:08 pm

You might point out to them that continental europe is totally abandoned by the big brands like Gibson (they send us their most crappy guitars) and that most european kids are very frustrated and there is a big market to eat. :D
nankurunai sa!

Daizo
Sus4add11
Posts: 43
Joined: Sun Jan 09, 2005 5:58 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Contact:

Post by Daizo » Sat Apr 30, 2005 6:04 pm

ned wrote:Daizo see if you can get the editors to join the forum!!!
If Tokai agrees to my site visit, I will invite these guys to go to Hamamatsu and recommend them to join the forum, too.

Above marketing opportunity scripts are quite helpful. Thank you very much. I have been watching LS130SEB offered in the auction, but it has never been sold, which implies their newer products are not that sold well in Japan. More open-minded overseas markets could be a key to help Tokai's operation. Having looked at their poor website, I think they may be over-relying on their quality, less on the marketing - good as a case study material for biz schools :):)
Daizo

sneakyjapan
Guitar God
Posts: 1871
Joined: Mon May 12, 2003 9:56 pm

Post by sneakyjapan » Sat Apr 30, 2005 6:53 pm

I think you`re correct about their newer stuff. For whatever reason most players I see here in Japan want US made guitars and are willing to pay a lot of dough for em. I watch the on line auctions in Japan as well and many older MIJs are getting their just dues...not only Tokai but others too...theres an old LS-50 going for 100,000 yen right now on a used site here... thats more than double the original selling price if you take into account the standard 20% off shops give here. I love my Duncans, my Van Zandt, CREWS, Bacchus, my old Japanese Fenders, Grecos and of course Tokais among others.

20 century boy
Guitar God
Posts: 1091
Joined: Tue May 06, 2003 1:45 pm
Location: Paris

Post by 20 century boy » Sat Apr 30, 2005 11:49 pm

I think it's a mix between keeping a good quality level in the production and taking th temperature of the guitar market. (Like for example: in france and belgium, everybody wants guitars with p-90 these days! It's absolutely amazing!) And Tokai is starting to have a good reputation!
nankurunai sa!

hans-j?rgen
Guitar God
Posts: 1741
Joined: Mon Feb 21, 2005 3:57 am
Location: Hamburg, Germany
Contact:

Post by hans-j?rgen » Sun May 01, 2005 3:09 am

Daizo wrote:If Tokai agrees to my site visit, I will invite these guys to go to Hamamatsu and recommend them to join the forum, too.
By the way, is there an english version of your homepage, too?
ZZee ya, Hans-Jürgen
BLUEZZ BASTARDZZ "That lil' ol' ZZ Top cover band from Hamburg"
INDIGO ROCKS "Down home rockin' blues. Tasty as strudel"

Post Reply