I think I solved my late 81 EGC1000 PU mystery!!!

[soundcreation]

So as many of you know there were late 81 Custom 1000's with unstamped and no sticker pickups.

Mine.....(there were other reports on these boards of the same thing)

81's were suppose to have Dry Z's and 82's usually have dry 82's. Of all the pictures I saw of ALL the greco pickups none looked the same but the Dry Z's were the closest, so I just went with the assumption that they were unstamped dry Z's as it seemed more logical than any of the other options.....until I found this tonight!

http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/other-les-pauls/118834-egc-800-greco-what-pickups-were-those.html

Looks like I have my match! And the 82 catalog lists Grooves as standard but to add confusion..according to wiki...it was only for the first year then dry 82's went in the EGC1000's. Which would explain why I always saw Dry Z or Dry 82's in all the other pictures I saw of customs from before and after.

I'm absolutely amazed at how good these pickups sound every time I play the guitar so it's nice to finally be about 100% sure of what they are.

Anyway...I know it's probably not that interesting to most but I thought if anyone else was still wondering as there were a couple others on here ages ago who had similar guitars.

 

[wulfman]

I love the pickups too - they have some common ground with the sound of DRY1982s I think.

By the way, I did notice that there were references to 1982 being the only year for Grooves in the EGC58-100, but the 83 and 84 catalogs also list them in the specs. It could also be that a lot of these later Grecos have no stickers so nobody really can tell what is in their guitars.

83 MC Specs


84 MC Specs


You can see a few more places where they used the GROOVE as well.

Cheers,

Wulfman

 

[soundcreation]

Cool...that's great information..thanks so much!

 

[greco_burst]

Yes, this is interesting.

When looking at names etc, and catalogues, which are all confusing based on when exactly they were produced, and which run of guitars from the factory etc.
I have a theory (opinion :wink: ) that Japan seems to produce new lines in the summer months (northern hemisphere).
So, for me, super real era will be produced until mid 1982 (hence the transitional models with super real and mint collection features in early 1982)

I owned a EGC1000 with a December 81 serial number, and unmarked pickups.

The 1981 catalogue lists screamin and the groove pups

1981 EG1000 lists DRY pups
1981 EGC800C lists Screamin pups

1981 SA900 / SA700 lists The Groove pups

1982 EGC68-80 lists Double Trick pups
1982 EGC58-100 lists The Groove pups

A EG1000C giveaway is the Ebony fret board, EG800C have rosewood.

The 1981 EG1000C i owned had a Super Real neck, super real headstock logo, nitro finish, fret edge binding, 3 piece back, and unmarked pups with gold covers. The only feature from a mint collection is the headstock inlay which is the flower pot and not the split diamond inlay.

My ears told me the sound was something special, much better than screamin (which are good). But sadly there was always a question mark about the pickups as to what they really are, and based on catalogues and the price of the guitar compared to EG800C the difference would have been fretboard, tuners and pickups only. So for a 20,000 yen difference you could justify ebony board and dry pups, that is why I believed they are Dry.

1982 catalogue pickup price list
Dry 20,000 yen
Double Trick 18,000 yen
The Groove 15,000 yen
Screamin 14,000 yen

So a 5,000 or 6,000 yen difference in price to Dry pups, and ebony fretboard costing 14 or 15,000 yen? to balance the 20,000 difference to EG800C...i don't think so.

I still believe based on price the pups are more likely to be Dry.

Interestingly again, the EG68-80 (80,000 yen) has the more expensive Double Trick 18,000 yen, and the EG58-100 (100,000 yen) has the cheaper The Groove pickups 15,000

wax on wax off beath in breath out wax on wax off :wink:

 

[jacco]

My July 1981 EGC1000 has full Super Real specs, incl Dry Z pups.
It has S/N G814341.

My former EGC500 with S/N 1 5555 had full Super Real era specs except for having flower pot headstock inlay.

I still don't know if the last 4 digits are production numbers but 4341 & 5555 are pretty close. If so somethere not far later than July 1981 the flower pot inlay appeared.

I have to say that I think that there were at least 2 plants were Greco bodies were produced for my EGC500 has the correct diagonal wire channel routing (like found on more examples from 1981 & 1982) unlike the normal straight Fujigen routing.

Maybe this will explain the use 2 different serial number formats at the same time; MYYXXXX and Y XXXX.

 

[japanstrat]

Maybe this will explain the use 2 different serial number formats at the same time; MYYXXXX and Y XXXX.

Not from what I've seen but there are still things not totally understood about the different serial number formats.
Even the Matsumoku made Greco SG's from the 70s used the same MYYXXXX serial number format as Fujigen was using for the Grecos and the Ibanez's.

The Y XXXX Greco serial format appears around 1979 and seems to be Fujigens as well as the MYYXXXX serial number format judging by how all the cavity routing was done.

Dyna Gakki made the Blazers for Ibanez (it's in Jim Donahue's Ibanez book) and Dyna Gakki used the same Fujigen MYYXXXX serial number format for these Ibanez Blazers.

Serial number formats are not always a good guide because the company producing the guitars can if they wish also dictate the same serial number format to be used at different factories.

The Orville by Gibsons have different Terada and Fujigen serial number formats and also different routing so the different routing pointed to different factories being involved and the different serial formats matched the different routing.

The Greco different serial number formats are not like the Orvilles as the Greco MYYXXXX and Y XXXX serial number formats can have the same routing in a lot of cases therefore pointing to Fujigen making the Greco MYYXXXX and Y XXXX serial numbers. The MYYXXXX and Y XXXX serial numbers can sometimes have different wire routing channels (diagonal, down the side) but the rest of the routing on the MYYXXXX and Y XXXX serial numbers seems to match.

Fujigen seemed to do both the diagonal wiring routing and the wiring down the side routing in the 80s but seemed to shift totally to the down the side routing in the 90s ie Orvilles.

Fujigen has many different sections in their factory complex.

 

[jacco]

It wouldn't be logical to use different serial number formats at the same time on the same factory complex for the same type of models, would it?
I think there will be an explanation for that in time.

Those diagonal wire channeled bodies are another thing: they seem only to appear on lower end models in 1981/82 and around 1989. I say outsourced.

 

[japanstrat]

The different serial numbers could be due to something like different distributors around Japan.

As far as I've been able to work out, It seems that it was not only Kanda Shokai involved in the Grecos distribution as Aria seemed to also be involved in distributing Grecos to some parts of Japan.

 

[Darth Vader]

Hi guys,

I just received my EGC-800(claimed by seller).
It has fret edge binding and serial number is E816623. It looks to me like a 3pc top and single pc back. (cant find any joints)
How do I know if it's a Super Real series or not?
The pickups have serial number 210428 but no other markings.
Any idea what pickups these are?
They sound rather different compared to the Screamin 82 in my other Greco so I don't think they are Screamin.
They sound warmer and less bright compared to the Screamin 82.

 

[muccax]

hi
own a greco egc 800 ..... it has a almost one piece body
95/5 % body and a 2 piece top ..... mine came with the wrong hard ware and pickups ,, it has super sound on the truss rod cover
it has serial A81xxxx
a egc 800 has got real MOP inlay an the neck ,,,so that is the best way to check if it is a egc 800
and i dont think a 3 piece top is a egc 800
3 piece top is only on the super power model
i got 3 egc 500 super power from 1982 ,,, they all have 3 piece top
but who know ,, it is possibelt to have a 3 piece top on a egc 800
all the best
otto

 

[Darth Vader]

hi
own a greco egc 800 ..... it has a almost one piece body
95/5 % body and a 2 piece top ..... mine came with the wrong hard ware and pickups ,, it has super sound on the truss rod cover
it has serial A81xxxx
a egc 800 has got real MOP inlay an the neck ,,,so that is the best way to check if it is a egc 800
and i dont think a 3 piece top is a egc 800
3 piece top is only on the super power model
i got 3 egc 500 super power from 1982 ,,, they all have 3 piece top
but who know ,, it is possibelt to have a 3 piece top on a egc 800
all the best
otto

Hi muccax,

Thanks for the info. I'd just like to clarify some points.
What do you mean when you say "95/5% body? You mean there is a cavity/chamber in the body? And when you say MOP inlay, do you mean only the headstock or the fret markings as well.
Mine has a solid body, no visible chamber under the maple top and it has MOP inlays on the headstock.
And mine has fret edge bindings as well. Do the Super Powers come with fret bindings too?
Wow. Now I am not sure what model my guitar is. It sucks if it turns out to be a Super Power coz the seller did not specify that. :roll:

Anyway, I appreciate all the info I can get. Better to know the truth even if it sucks.

PS: I'd post pics but I donno how...

 

[JVsearch]

hi
own a greco egc 800 ..... it has a almost one piece body
95/5 % body and a 2 piece top ..... mine came with the wrong hard ware and pickups ,, it has super sound on the truss rod cover
it has serial A81xxxx
a egc 800 has got real MOP inlay an the neck ,,,so that is the best way to check if it is a egc 800
and i dont think a 3 piece top is a egc 800
3 piece top is only on the super power model
i got 3 egc 500 super power from 1982 ,,, they all have 3 piece top
but who know ,, it is possibelt to have a 3 piece top on a egc 800
all the best
otto

Hi muccax,

Thanks for the info. I'd just like to clarify some points.
What do you mean when you say "95/5% body? You mean there is a cavity/chamber in the body? And when you say MOP inlay, do you mean only the headstock or the fret markings as well.
Mine has a solid body, no visible chamber under the maple top and it has MOP inlays on the headstock.
And mine has fret edge bindings as well. Do the Super Powers come with fret bindings too?
Wow. Now I am not sure what model my guitar is. It sucks if it turns out to be a Super Power coz the seller did not specify that. :roll:

Anyway, I appreciate all the info I can get. Better to know the truth even if it sucks.

PS: I'd post pics but I donno how...

I think he means the body has two pieces but one piece is so big that it makes up 95% of the entire body.
That then leaves 5% of the body area in the small second piece - probably just the top semi-circle of the rear bout?
Maybe even a little bit of the front upper bout as well (where the pickup switch is), in other words it could pretty much be considered a one piece body.

Don't you mean you'd post pics, but haven't bothered to get it organised! :wink:

 

[Darth Vader]

Don't you mean you'd post pics, but haven't bothered to get it organised! :wink:

No! I mean I'd post pics but don't know how to do it.
I have all the pics in my hard drive folder but can't seem to attach them to the post. How do i do it?

Do i need to put them in a website/host site before i can post them here?

Directions greatly appreciated.

Thanks.

DV

 

[Max The Dog]

Yes you do have to use a host site, try Photobucket.com they are quick easy and free

 

[muccax]

hi
yes a allmost one piece body ,,,
and FEB ,,,, real MOP inlay on the neck
a big big neck ,,, and 4.4 kg
all the best
otto

 

[Darth Vader]

Hi guys,

Finally, uploading pictures.
Please tell me what you think.
1) What pickups do you think they are?
2) What series? (Super Power?)

 

[wulfman]

Sorry to say, but that sure looks like a EGC-500 Super Power. Great guitar, but it should not be sold as an EGC-800. The catalog says 3-pc top for the EGC-500 model. It is hard to tell though as the finish is probably very thin poly that may even look like lacquer. My EGC-500 was like that.
Very nice guitars.

If you want to compare, here is a slideshow of my old ECG-500, now sold.

Click on the picture for the slideshow:

 

[Darth Vader]

Geeez....
Got conned on EBay by the seller.
Never buy from him again. :x

Thanks, Wulfman.

 

[wulfman]

Geeez....
Got conned on EBay by the seller.
Never buy from him again. :x

Thanks, Wulfman.

Did it come from Aomori Japan? I think we were discussing the same guitar over on another forum a couple of weeks back. I sent the seller a request to tell the number of pieces on the top but never got a reply. It may be that he honestly thought it was an EGC-800 because they look pretty similar.
For what you get though it could have been worse I guess. I liked my Super Power a lot, all I would have changed are the pickups. Nice looking guitar.