Dowel tenon on 1980-81 Tokai LS50 & 60?!

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jacco

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Hi, I'm new here.
Has anyone noticed that the LS50 & 60 from 1980-81 with ink stamped serial numbers all have dowel tenons? At least all 5 I have seen so far.
It's a shame I don't have pics of all of them but one is on Ebay right now:
http://imageevent.com/chingo123/february2010/tokailoverocksbls604917?p=39&n=1&m=-1&c=4&l=0&w=4&s=0&z=2
 
There are a few posts on the forum about this....

Have a look here

http://www.tokaiforum.com/viewtopic.php?p=80329&highlight=dowel#80329


Dave
 
Thanks Dave!
Yes I have read many threads about this subject. I was actually looking for new info or someone with authority who can confirm the following:

One of the most interesting observations made on this forum was the fact the controls cavity of an inkie has a different carve from a 'normal' Tokai, suggesting that the body was made somewhere else.

So could it be the case that the neck was provided by the Tokai factory in Hamamatsu and the body made in another factory where the complete guitar was assembled?

Now, I came accross a website of a japanese guitar collector and he states the following:

'Once there was a arguing over the serial number of Tokai Les Pauls. As far as I know, the conclusion was that stamped serial numbers were given to Tokai Les Paul model LS-50/60 which were made in Nagano only in 1980~1981, and engraved numbers were given to the other guitars. But I think that this conclusion still need to argue, because I have a TLS-200/1983 with stamped serial number.
According to the conclusion, this one was made in Nagano which located on the north of the head factory Hamamatsu over 150km as crow flies.'

1. Nagano? 2. An inkie from 1983 and it's an LS200??

1. For me this info strenghtens the belief that the body of an inkie was made & the guitar assembled at the Fujigen factory.
Why? The Fujigen factory stands in Matsumotu city; that's in the Nagano prefecure. And there's the dowel tenon ofcourse.. Fujigen made Greco's.

2. Assumption nr 2; Fujigen Gakki was a very large factory where several brand guitars were made = cheaper labor?
Was Tokai cutting cost for lower end models during a period of rise of demand, hence the 1980-81 LS50-60s? After 1982 Tokai progressively got financial problems ending in it's bankrupcy 1985, hence the 1983 TLS200.

Input is welcome!
 
jacco said:
Thanks Dave!
Yes I have read many threads about this subject. I was actually looking for new info or someone with authority who can confirm the following:

One of the most interesting observations made on this forum was the fact the controls cavity of an inkie has a different carve from a 'normal' Tokai, suggesting that the body was made somewhere else.

So could it be the case that the neck was provided by the Tokai factory in Hamamatsu and the body made in another factory where the complete guitar was assembled?

Now, I came accross a website of a japanese guitar collector and he states the following:

'Once there was a arguing over the serial number of Tokai Les Pauls. As far as I know, the conclusion was that stamped serial numbers were given to Tokai Les Paul model LS-50/60 which were made in Nagano only in 1980~1981, and engraved numbers were given to the other guitars. But I think that this conclusion still need to argue, because I have a TLS-200/1983 with stamped serial number.
According to the conclusion, this one was made in Nagano which located on the north of the head factory Hamamatsu over 150km as crow flies.'

1. Nagano? 2. An inkie from 1983 and it's an LS200??

1. For me this info strenghtens the belief that the body of an inkie was made & the guitar assembled at the Fujigen factory.
Why? The Fujigen factory stands in Matsumotu city; that's in the Nagano prefecure. And there's the dowel tenon ofcourse.. Fujigen made Greco's.

2. Assumption nr 2; Fujigen Gakki was a very large factory where several brand guitars were made = cheaper labor?
Was Tokai cutting cost for lower end models during a period of rise of demand, hence the 1980-81 LS50-60s? After 1982 Tokai progressively got financial problems ending in it's bankrupcy 1985, hence the 1983 TLS200.

Input is welcome!

I'm out..... anyone?
 
Here's an update on this subject.
I have had email contact with 2 Japanese guitar collectors and they both told me that there was indeed another Tokai factory besides Hamamatsu, one in Nagano (150 km up north). That's were the ink stamped Tokai's were made.
I will quote one here:

Konnichiwa Jacco,

Grecos were made in Matsumoku (Matsumoto Mokkou) factory
in Matsumoto, that was definitely different from Nagano
factory of Tokai Gakki in Matsumoto.

Best regards
Hiroyuki Yamauchi

So the Nagano branch of Tokai guitars stood in Matsumoto, same town were Greco's etc were made.
I was also told that because the traditional relationship between employer and employee in Japan it's unthinkable that employees worked in 2 factories at the same time.
It's still a mystery to me why both early Greco's as early ink stamped Tokai's both have a dowel tenon, except for the fact that the people that made them worked in the same city.
 
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