Springy ???

Area for Tokai's older than 1985

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settebello
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Post by settebello » Fri Apr 27, 2007 10:33 am

Hi Rossi,
did you're Rosewoodneck has a Skunkstripe?

Volker

Rossi
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Post by Rossi » Fri Apr 27, 2007 10:42 am

Yes it has: ive pm you because i dont know how to post pics yet
Cheers

settebello
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Post by settebello » Fri Apr 27, 2007 10:46 am

I ask the question,because my springy has also Rosewood Fingerboard
and Skunkstripe (8 Hole Pickguard).Maby they are not vintage correct.

Volker

XLarge
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Post by XLarge » Fri Apr 27, 2007 1:42 pm

settebello wrote:I ask the question,because my springy has also Rosewood Fingerboard
and Skunkstripe (8 Hole Pickguard).Maby they are not vintage correct.

Volker
Remember that the first Stratocasters from '59 had Single ply pickguard with 8 holes and rosewood fretboard. Or maple neck with 11 holes 3 ply pickguard (but without skunkstripe).
So If i have a guitar with rosewood fretboard, 8 screw holes and single ply pickguard teorically I could have a copy of a '59 Strat.
However, I like Goldstar instead Springy because they are more accurate about vintage specs.
Last edited by XLarge on Fri Apr 27, 2007 4:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

settebello
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Post by settebello » Fri Apr 27, 2007 3:49 pm

:o Are you sure?I found only Fenders 1958:Mable neck,8 Hole Pickguard
1959: Rosewood,11 Hole Pickguard.
And whats about the Skunkstripe on Rosewoodnecks?Peter says there
where only made in 1979,but my Springy is a 1980.
Dont know,whats Rossi's SN says,but might be interesting?

Volker

XLarge
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Post by XLarge » Fri Apr 27, 2007 4:51 pm

settebello wrote::o Are you sure?I found only Fenders 1958:Mable neck,8 Hole Pickguard
1959: Rosewood,11 Hole Pickguard.
And whats about the Skunkstripe on Rosewoodnecks?Peter says there
where only made in 1979,but my Springy is a 1980.
Dont know,whats Rossi's SN says,but might be interesting?

Volker
Tokai Strat guitars with small headstock are replicas of Stratocaster Pre CBS era ('54-'65).
And for these guitars ONLY maple neck has skunk strip. This is the reason why I say that Tokai with rosewood fretboard and skunk strip are for me hystoric false. You can find on old Strato of '59 (the year neck and other specs were changed) maple or rosewood with pickguard 8/10/11 screwholes and 1 or 3 ply pickguard. This because when Fender changed specs (from maple to rosewwod and from 1 ply to 3 ply pickguard), they had in stock many parts of previous years, so in the very early 1959 Stratocasters was simple to find "hybrid" combinations of necks and pickguards (very $$$ and rare on vintage market). But all Stratocaster I have seen on books, website and so on, only maple necks have skunkstripe. Not rosewood. Sincerly I don't know why Tokai (but Greco too) have put skunkstripe on a Stratocaster with rosewood fretboard and small headstock.
Here is an interesting quote:
Maple fingerboard, 1950s: from the start in 1950, Fender used a one piece maple neck with a walnut "skunk" stripe down the back (except on early Esquires with no truss rod), where the truss rod was installed. This was the standard neck on all models until 1958 (when the Jazzmaster was introduced with a rosewood fingerboard; the rest of the Fender models changed to rosewood fingerboards in mid-1959).

Maple fingerboards, 1960-1968: available as special order. Different than the 1950s one-piece maple necks. These used an actual slab maple fingerboard glued to the maple neck, and no "skunk stripe" down the back of the neck for the truss rod.
And this about hybrid combination:
* Starting May 1959 "slab" Rosewood fingerboard with white "clay" position dots and 7.25" finger board radius. Bottom of fingerboard (part glued to maple) is flat. This change was implemented for the summer 1959 NAMM show. Basically Strats 5/59 and later will have rosewood fingerboards.
* Celluloid "mint green" three layer (white/black/white) pickguard (sometimes called a "nitro" pickguard), with 11 attachment screws. This celluloid pickguard was implemented around 7/59. So for a short time rosewood fingerboard Strats were made with a single layer white pickguard with 11 screws. Some 7/59 Strats even had a single layer white pickguard with 8 or 9 or 10 screws (though this is rare). Also in the same time period some 1959 Strats were made with a maple neck and a 8 screw three layer celluloid pickguard (this implies the body will not have a "shoulder" under the pickguard in the control cavity).
* A thin aluminum sheild the size of the pickguard is installed underneath the three layer pickguard. This replaces the thicker and much smaller shield previously used on single layer pickguards (this older style shield encompassed just the three pots and the switch).
* Stratocaster body now has a "shoulder" in the potentiometer control cavity. This "bump" in the cavity was implemented to allow the use of another pickguard screw by the 3-way switch. This shoulder can only be seen with the pickguard removed. All rosewood fingerboard Strat bodies with 11 pickguard screws should have this shoulder.
* Fender used a very photo-reactive red dye in their sunburst finish, causing many 1959 Strats to fade from a 3-color sunburst to a 2-colors (the photo-reactive nature of the red caused fading from ultra-violet light). This is typically seen on the front of the body, where the back often still has the red in the sunburst. If the pickguard is lifted, the original red finish in the sunburst can still be seen.
* Neck now has a very thin "D" backshape. As 1959 progresses, the neck backshape gets even thinner. By the end of 1959, the neck has an extremely thin backshape. Also most mid to late year 1959 Strats will usually not have a neck date below the truss rod adjustment.
* Brown paper rectangle tone cap changes to white "chicklet" paper tone capacitor.
* A metal spacer was added below the butterfly string tree.
Image

7/59 rosewood fingerboard Strat with single layer white pickguard.
Note the red has faded from the sunburst finish.

Image

A 1959 Strat with a maple neck and an 8 screw three layer celluloid pickguard.

Sorry if I'm gone OFF TOPIC, but look.......
What a beauties... :P :D
The first pic made me crazy...

settebello
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Post by settebello » Fri Apr 27, 2007 5:21 pm

Maby thats a interesting Theme for another Topic,but is also interesting for Tokai Owners,because its a copy (clone)or not.
Very nice vintage Fenders you found.But in Fact that says,my ST100
is a Hybrid,because of the Scunkstripe on Rosewoodfingerbord and
the 8 Hole Fingerboard.

Volker
Last edited by settebello on Fri Apr 27, 2007 5:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

XLarge
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Post by XLarge » Fri Apr 27, 2007 5:28 pm

settebello wrote:But thats what i say,early Springys are not vintage correct.But anyway
they are great sounding Strats. 8)

Volker
Sorry :P :P
We was speaking about the same thing :D :D
That's the reason because I prefer Goldstars.
I agree with you Springy or Goldstar, they sound damn well !!!

settebello
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Post by settebello » Fri Apr 27, 2007 5:43 pm

:P OOHH we post at the same Time. Yes the sound,maby i say its quite
good. :o :wink: :D :D :D

Volker

Peter Mac
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Post by Peter Mac » Fri Apr 27, 2007 6:26 pm

Hi guys,
to follow the Tokai models, you need to understand the Fender lineage - as they were the models cloned.
essentially
rosewood neck = 3 ply, 11 hole pickguard no skunkstripe;
maple neck = skunk stripe, 1ply 8 hole pickguard
78/79 Tokais did have rosewood/skunk necks and some did carry over into 1980 but these models had a number impressed at the end of the fingerboard to signify the model [ eg '80' = ST80 ]
The stamp in the pickup cavity was used on SilverStar models mainly, with Springy/Goldstar having the stamp in the control cavity. This is really the rule of thumb as the routes were different on Silver and Springys
regards
Peter Mac
The world will not end today...because it is already tomorrow in Australia.

settebello
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Post by settebello » Fri Apr 27, 2007 7:19 pm

Oh,peter, thanks for your're repley.
I have a ST100 Rosewood/Skunkstripe.
Is that vintage correct and when it is what Year is it copy?
Thanks for your repley.

Volker

Rossi
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Post by Rossi » Sat Apr 28, 2007 3:06 am

Image

Image

Image

My new Baby off e-bay
What you all think,and this has a rosewood neck.
With original case dated 3/10/1979
But it has new saddles :cry: i could do with originals
E stamped pups & a 3 way switch

XLarge
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Post by XLarge » Sat Apr 28, 2007 5:28 am

Beautiful grain..... :P

Rossi
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Post by Rossi » Sat Apr 28, 2007 5:56 am

See another 1979 8 screw pickguard with a rosewood neck in Japan :roll:
DID they make um like this then or is there a (Tokai Fairy) fitting them after market :P
and yes ive noticed the 80 stamped in the fret

Link
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/1979-Tokai-ST-80- ... dZViewItem

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Post by Cybercat » Sat Apr 28, 2007 8:21 am

My 1980 ST-60 is also like this, rosewood fingerboard, skunk stripe _
..but 11 screw-holes for the original pickguard.

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