ES-260 vs. ES-155

what's the difference except the pups, price and bumblebees?

thanks

Roe

Some,but I guess they will be subtle to the eye in pictures.You just have to play both models to feel the difference.I can bet there is some difference in feel and sound between both comparable LS models.Just buy both guitars and judge by yourself :wink: .I would do it if I could,you can be sure!

of course, the fretboard is different too. But I suspect that mostly you'll be paying for the rolph pups.

I feel you don't Roe.Just trust me when I say a LS320 is different than a LS150(and worth the price difference to me).Well, you could be paying the Rolphs and the inflaction and wood price increase in new LS380.This kind of post is the reason I would like to try both ES models.....

well, the LS320 and 150 have diffent specs, but the Es260 and 155 hardly have diffent specs. I'm not interested in the pups.

Jeezus!.....

If you have access to both guitars and are shopping them, play each of them and decide for yourself. You tell us what the difference is between them... here in the states, we never see those models and for myself, I can't offer an objective opinion on the either of them. What I can tell you is that my 81 Tokai ES100 is hands down a better ES335 than any Gibson I've ever played and I wouldn't trade it for an ES900 if one existed.

As you stated, you're not interested in the pickups, then what are you interested in? The pedigree or the sound?

I'm not trying to sound harsh but are we forgetting about what it is YOU want in terms of a guitar? Please educate us......I'm dying to hear what you think about them.

is this not the user that asked wether the fretboards on the tokais were indian rosewood or african rosewood?

I'm sorry man but you're a little mental about this stuff, go play your guitar, get away from the computer...

I can't try both guitars here in Norway. I just asked about the specs of these two models. To me, the specs of the 260 doesn't justify the much higher price than the 155. the ES-260 also seems to be a bit rare.

bruno said:

is this not the user that asked wether the fretboards on the tokais were indian rosewood or african rosewood?

I'm sorry man but you're a little mental about this stuff, go play your guitar, get away from the computer...

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yes, it's me.
So you say it's not ok to even ask about the fretboard wood. You have to imply that I play little, use the computer alot and are "mental" about this.
Do something else than insulting people bruno! Play your guitar and stay away from your computer. I won't tolerate this **** from you.

I my opinion, the top and fretboard woods are the most important factors determining a guitars acustic sound. [Regarding fretboard woods, see for instance http://www.suhrguitars.com/wood.htm and http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=141191]

Gibson have used different fretboard woods and top woods for their 335s. Some 335 can sound muddy and my claim is that the wood can contribute to this.
I just tried to investigate what wood types the tokais are made of. Instead of trying to give an answer bruno starts insulting people.

Roe said:

Do something else than insulting people bruno! Play your guitar and stay away from your computer. I won't tolerate this ^&*( from you.

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Relax, Bruno

the man can tell the diference between a guitar with indian/african rosewod, yet asks for diferences via net, try them out...

worry not togps, I won't opinionate more about this subject... after all it kind of speaks for itself... :wink:

and yes I do think you should play more other than post links to prove that something sounds the way, someone claims it to sound... go play your guitar

well,
since you can't hear the sound of my guitars, the best I can do is to point to what good luthiers like john suhr says.

I've never claimed to be able to "tell the diference between a guitar with indian/african rosewo[o]d". I just asked.

from the indian/african rosewood topic:

Roe said:

yes it does matter. indian can sound muddy in gibbys

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I rest my case... and like I said I won't be opionating anymore about this subject...

OK,about specs.I bet Tokai is putting their best wood on ES260(the one reserved),you know there are some grade on wood.....Tokai has got a special order request in acoustics where you can cghoose some things,I've seen this in a recent catalogue.Besides just remember there is a "Master Luthier" who builds the highest ranges for Tokai so my guess is ES260 will be made by this man surely(a sort od "Master Builder" thing?)....

bruno said:

from the indian/african rosewood topic:

Roe said:

yes it does matter. indian can sound muddy in gibbys

Click to expand...

I rest my case... and like I said I won't be opionating anymore about this subject...

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bruno,

I'll try to clarify: while (I claim that) indian rosewood can - but won't always - sound muddy in gibbys, I've never claimed that I (always) can "tell the diference between a guitar with indian/african rosewo[o]d".

know what...I think we all take this dissecting of guitars a little over the top sometimes... wood types, thickness of tops, aluminium or steel, reliced or not, fretboard binding or not... it seems endless. I really like talking about guitars too but I enjoy playing them more...so gotta go.

sneakyjapan said:

know what...I think we all take this dissecting of guitars a little over the top sometimes... wood types, thickness of tops, aluminium or steel, reliced or not, fretboard binding or not... it seems endless. I really like talking about guitars too but I enjoy playing them more...so gotta go.

Click to expand...

personally, I care more about sound than looks. so to me fretboard binding ain't important. But one of the main problems with gibson type guitars is that they can sound muddy in the mix - esp. in two guitar bands where both guitarists are using guitars with humbuckers and fat tones (marshall etc.)
Me and my friends have often had problems with gibsons sounding muddy in a band context.

What was the topic again? :lol:

I'd think a muddy mix with good equipment (Gibsons and Marshalls) might have something to do with your EQ levels on the amps and/or guitars. Just a thought......

Er ....

Not to re-rake the muck, but ...

How could anyone playing an ES-335 through a Marshall (say, in excess of 18 tube or valve watts) even hear the difference?* I say that it would in fact be impossible to hear something so minor as the fretboard tonality no matter what you played it through. There is the slim possibility that the difference in fretboard wood could make the unplugged fundamental tone of the guitar itself sound slightly different, but it's the sound of the body resonance that the pickups come through which affect the basic tone, in my opinion. I mean, how could you even scientifically scope the acoustic, fundamental, unplugged tone so that a guitarist with a hearing deficit (which most of us probably are, I suspect - TURN THAT &@!^ DOWN!! ) could actually hear it - it seems to me that one would get a different fundamental tone each time out for every different guitar, depending on the type of mahogany and maple and how much air is in the cavity, etc. And then you'd have to plug the sucker in and kill more hearing cells trying to hear it. So when people make claims like this that they can hear a difference, I really have to wonder.

I mean, I can't even tell the diff between an all-maple Strat neck and a rosewood-capped one, and I've been playing for 30-plus years. I don't think there is an appreciable difference that makes sense to my human ears, anyway (to an ant's, sure, OK)

*oops - forgot about Eric Johnson :lol:

Usally I can hear if a fender has rosewood fretboard or maple. The gibsons are not so easy to hear, but usally the ebony is quite different from rosewood.

there is a lot of factors that can contribute to some gibsons's muddy sound:
- pots
- pups (fat sound etc)
- woods
- hardware