tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Tokai guitar discussion

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vaporboy
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tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Post by vaporboy » Sun Sep 06, 2009 1:08 pm

This is a very odd make of guitar - firstly only Japanese were any good (all Korean builts were considered crap), now the Korean ones are now also good but the Chinese/Indonesian ones are crap. Oh and bye the way, the Canadian ones are also crap except for the Ricky copies which are rarer than hen's teeth so can't possibly be crap. What a bunch of bull - I have a Canadian Korean built Love Rock that has been given 100% thumbs up by a guy that has 3 top notch Les Pauls. How can anyone follow all this bulls**t, if it plays good, sounds good and holds up, good enough surely?

f5joe
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Post by f5joe » Sun Sep 06, 2009 1:14 pm

Bad dose of Wheaties this morning mate? :lol:
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marcusnieman
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Re: tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Post by marcusnieman » Sun Sep 06, 2009 1:23 pm

vaporboy wrote:This is a very odd make of guitar - firstly only Japanese were any good (all Korean builts were considered crap), now the Korean ones are now also good but the Chinese/Indonesian ones are crap. Oh and bye the way, the Canadian ones are also crap except for the Ricky copies which are rarer than hen's teeth so can't possibly be crap. What a bunch of bull - I have a Canadian Korean built Love Rock that has been given 100% thumbs up by a guy that has 3 top notch Les Pauls. How can anyone follow all this bulls**t, if it plays good, sounds good and holds up, good enough surely?
Bro, it's no different than Fender:

First the MIJ were consdidered crap. Now they're good

Then the Made in Mexico were crap. Now they're good

Then the Made in China were crap - now the Squire Classic Vibe series are getting rave reviews.

Go find somewhere else to stir up sh*t.

stratman323

Post by stratman323 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:55 pm

What is the point of this thread?

Mike

leadguitar_323
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Re: tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Post by leadguitar_323 » Sun Sep 06, 2009 5:57 pm

vaporboy wrote:This is a very odd make of guitar - firstly only Japanese were any good (all Korean builts were considered crap), now the Korean ones are now also good but the Chinese/Indonesian ones are crap. Oh and bye the way, the Canadian ones are also crap except for the Ricky copies which are rarer than hen's teeth so can't possibly be crap. What a bunch of bull - I have a Canadian Korean built Love Rock that has been given 100% thumbs up by a guy that has 3 top notch Les Pauls. How can anyone follow all this bulls**t, if it plays good, sounds good and holds up, good enough surely?
HAHAHAHAHAHA......What is your point? apart from knowing nothing about what you are talking about..!! So your buddy was stupid enough to buy 3 Gibsons, define top notch, I have owned plenty of gibsons and only ever had one good one and it was 3 times as much as my Tokai's and even more than my other MIJ guitars and ALL of my Japanese guitars are better, without exception. And i would almost bet that your Korean Love rock is a FAKE anyway as Canada is full of Fake Tokai's, so you are probably comparing sour grapes with rancid oranges.... :o

If you want to REALLY know whats going on try asking, there's less chance of making a fool of yourself.....

Mick
so many guitars....so little money...

SUSHI GUY
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Post by SUSHI GUY » Sun Sep 06, 2009 7:02 pm

8) its the moral that is the problem with those fake tokais in the canadian market, spread by the ex-canadian bad ditributer. they made the fakes by themselves and because of it they lost the dealership from tokai. the quality of those fake canadian market tokais might be as good as all the other regular korean guitars but like i said its the moral we are talking about not the quality. i am sure they play good like the other korean guitars. yet ofcourse they are the fakes planned and ordered by some bad guys not tokai themselves. u know simply that stealing something good from others is bad and this should be the same everywhere including in the canadian used gtr market. its too late now since they made many and gone. but no need to support them really. just use them as the tools with the fake tokai name, is the most you can do. you know they are the morally wrong stuff and you can always get other good gtrs in canada and from usa, to play and love seriously. i wonder how many of them were made and who has them now. but its good that they dont make em anymore. now less victims possible....j
Last edited by SUSHI GUY on Mon Sep 07, 2009 6:05 am, edited 2 times in total.

Diamond
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Post by Diamond » Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:35 pm

lol, vaporboy.

I could never play a 'Fakai', even if it played good, because everytime I held it in my hands I'd feel like vomiting, because it's an ILLEGAL guitar made by a FRAUDSTER...in fact it's a STOLEN guitar...if it's a 'Fakai' then it's STOLEN.

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Post by greco_burst » Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:55 pm

Hi Vaporboy

"Tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous" :o

No no no.....
What it is, is a sad situation now, buyers who thought they got a great deal on a Tokai, its no longer so. They have been duped, by a shonky lowlife.
If you enjoy your fake Tokai, then ...fine.
Can i suggest you direct your frustrations to the lowlife who created this, and not the TF.
Should you ever buy a fake Gibson or Fender at some stage, go to the Gibson Forum or Fender Forum, and promote it as you may, that is...., if you and your friend think it is a fine instrument, and see what happens... :lol:
I do feel sorry for those who have been duped, not those who promote them.
regards,

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Re: tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Post by Ozeshin » Mon Sep 07, 2009 7:16 am

vaporboy wrote:This is a very odd make of guitar - firstly only Japanese were any good (all Korean builts were considered crap), now the Korean ones are now also good but the Chinese/Indonesian ones are crap. Oh and bye the way, the Canadian ones are also crap except for the Ricky copies which are rarer than hen's teeth so can't possibly be crap. What a bunch of bull - I have a Canadian Korean built Love Rock that has been given 100% thumbs up by a guy that has 3 top notch Les Pauls. How can anyone follow all this bulls**t, if it plays good, sounds good and holds up, good enough surely?
Hey...it could be the holy grail of guitars that makes you blow a load just walking near it...get's you bedded by super models and worshiped by millions....but it STILL aint a Tokai and THAT'S the whole point.
Nobody here has EVER said that the fakai aren't good guitars...from all we've seen they appear to be well made guitars.
I'm guessing that you've only just now noticed the "Make under License" transfer on the back of your guitar and are pissed that you now realize that you're in the ranks of the Fakai owners club and not OUR ranks :roll:

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Re: tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Post by JVsearch » Mon Sep 07, 2009 8:04 am

leadguitar_323 wrote:...I have owned plenty of gibsons and only ever had one good one
Sorry to pick on you Mick, but...

You get this tired story about Gibsons all over the internet - only one in 3/5/7/20 are any good, yeah, yeah... It's called Gibson bashing. All I can think is that those persons must have bought all their Gibsons without playing them first, why else would they have bought a crap guitar? :D

I had 3 Gibbys and they were all good, the Historic really was an excellent LP, but I sold it and got almost 3 Japanese guitars for the same money! Yes, the fit and finish of the Japanese product is a little better (actually a lot better on the non-vintage style clones-Duke), but tone-wise the Gibson Historic is right up there, if not better.

I don't like Gibson bashing because without Gibson there would be no Love Rocks, Dukes etc. The LP is essentially a creation out of Western Culture, end of story.

Regarding Fakais, my wilfully one-eyed view is that they're of no interest to me at all. Do they have a right to exist? Not on this forum!
Totally biased towards Japanese made guitars.

vaporboy
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Post by vaporboy » Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:28 am

But this is my whole point - noone seems to know what is fake, what isn't fake, and it's not helped by Tokai themselves putting guitars out there with serial numbers/without serial numbers etc. At least Fender do that. My 'Fakai' has no serial numbers anywhere, no stickers, nothing, it just says TKM on it and noone seems to know what that means either. I'm far from pissed off about my purchase as it is the best playing guitar in my collection (and before you jump down my throat I do have some very nice guitars to compare it to), and it was very cheap - I just find the whole thing strange that's all.

Ozeshin
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Post by Ozeshin » Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:50 am

But this is my whole point - noone seems to know what is fake, what isn't fake
Now THERE'S a stoopid statement..!!!!
As far as the LP/PRS/Gretch Fakai's go YES..we KNOW what is fake and what isn't fake....
Mick and I are in the process of putting together a site that points out the things that set the fakai apart from the Tokai.
I just find the whole thing strange that's all.
What's so strange about it?
One disgraced Tokai distributor in Canada was denied custom orders from Tokai so he consigned various Korean factories to build some mongrels and slap a Tokai logo on 'em.
Said distributor has opened up once again and is selling them via ebay to clear his stock so the sheer numbers that he must have had built is staggering.
Basically...we're glad you like your Fake Tokai...good for you...but we don't need to hear about them coz basically the principal disgusts us...now politely SHUT UP :P

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Re: tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Post by SUSHI GUY » Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:29 am

JVsearch wrote:
leadguitar_323 wrote:...I have owned plenty of gibsons and only ever had one good one
Sorry to pick on you Mick, but...

You get this tired story about Gibsons all over the internet - only one in 3/5/7/20 are any good, yeah, yeah... It's called Gibson bashing. All I can think is that those persons must have bought all their Gibsons without playing them first, why else would they have bought a crap guitar? :D

I had 3 Gibbys and they were all good, the Historic really was an excellent LP, but I sold it and got almost 3 Japanese guitars for the same money! Yes, the fit and finish of the Japanese product is a little better (actually a lot better on the non-vintage style clones-Duke), but tone-wise the Gibson Historic is right up there, if not better.

I don't like Gibson bashing because without Gibson there would be no Love Rocks, Dukes etc. The LP is essentially a creation out of Western Culture, end of story.

Regarding Fakais, my wilfully one-eyed view is that they're of no interest to me at all. Do they have a right to exist? Not on this forum!
8) maybe all the gibbos mick had bought in the past were the norin-era gibbos. mainly the 70s stuff......gibson has/had been veeeery sloppy over the years and sometimes even crazy for the crazy prices and bad overall quality. as i have seen, the norin era is lifeless a lot and the post 1986 gibson usa, between 1995 til 2000 so many misrable ones. at the time they were so growing they were selling so much especially in usa and japan. so the prices and quality were really sloppy. forgotton. they didnt seem to care much. gibson however seems to be doing better again after 2002/2005 maybe......lately their products are flawless yet again some of their new models have the non-sense design. i have a buddy at gibson japan and he is telling me lately that gibson has a lot of problems again right now inside the company.......something has to do with henry's past wrong too muuch expanding business plans or something. they are needing a lot of money and mahogany to keep running the company now. i heard this a few times.......j

@hey mickman, r u the member of the other gtr forums? i didnt know and never asked you before did i? which ones???

@JV, thanks for the pm. my good one on the way soon! thanks!

8) 8)

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Post by Paladin2019 » Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:52 am

vaporboy wrote:My 'Fakai' has no serial numbers anywhere, no stickers, nothing, it just says TKM on it and noone seems to know what that means either.
Why should anyone know what it means? It's an illegal fake, it doesn't matter!

Tokai shouldn't have to worry about making their numbering systems compliant with these masquerading monstrosities.

Nobody has ever said that these are badly made guitars. Quite the opposite in some cases. But their very existence is immoral, illegal and unethical. THAT's what we have a problem with - nothing to do with their qualities as an instrument.

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Re: tokai is getting just a bit ridiculous

Post by vikingblues » Mon Sep 07, 2009 4:50 pm

JVsearch wrote:I don't like Gibson bashing because without Gibson there would be no Love Rocks, Dukes etc. The LP is essentially a creation out of Western Culture, end of story.
I don't see much "Gibson bashing" on the early models which did create that style of guitar - quite the reverse. Much sought after guitars - with good reason.

What I seem to see is "Gibson bashing" where they have let standards drop (but not prices) at various times over the years. When I see top professional musicians advising the need to try 10 or 20 Les Pauls to get a good one I cannot find the enthusiasm to do that or to spend a large amount of travel expenses and time as well.

Plus I can be pretty sure that between them the factory and the shop will have been unlikely to have made available a guitar for demonstration that is really well set up. Why not?? - Tokai and Richtone manage it between them. Perhaps I am just unlucky with the local Gibson outlets or perhaps the rumour is true that the best Gibsons are sold in the US market and the others go overseas.

I'm not anti-Gibson - I've had a Gibson Standard (sold in bad times) that was very very good and was my first real quality guitar, but it was no better than the Tokai LC85 or LS equivalent and its a hell of a price differential. To go down the Historic route to get a better tone the price differential gets really silly.

I also tried Gibsons at the same sort of price level as the LC85 - moving into the realms of Specials, Fadeds etc and the tone was far below the Gibson Standard model and the quality of finish and fittings on one in particular was on a par with something knocked together on a kitchen table with old radio parts - very disappointing as I had thought I would one day get another Gibson. This disappointment was a major factor in my looking at Tokais in the first place. If this post sounds anti-Gibson it is probably because of that disappointment.

I tried a second hand Tokai - very nice tone and quality. I bought a new Tokai - I did not need to try a batch of new ones - the quality was first rate on the first one and the guitar "sings".

I also prefer Tokais range of sensible, well made, guitars. A nice lack of over-priced signature editions, over-priced relic'd hack jobs, and those loopy, multi coloured, lollipop, laminated wood editions. Not that these are specifically Gibson - all the major manufacturers seem to be suffering from this disease.
All I can think is that those persons must have bought all their Gibsons without playing them first, why else would they have bought a crap guitar?
Why should people who haven't tried a guitar built by a supposedly high quality manufacturer be likely to get a "crap" guitar? I would hope a quality luthier would only make and sell good quality guitars! There is no excuse for a guitar costing thousands to be poor quality.

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