Mystery Stone Logo Fernandes?.

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we'll go with Matsumoku build if the add is correct.

That's what I'm not so sure about... that's why I posted the Kawai-made neck pocket (if you zoom in there are faint indentations around the hole there too). It seems voidoid56 isn't quite convinced about the timeline either, scroll down in this thread

https://www.tokaiforum.com/threads/hidden-gems-early-80s-fernandes-limited-edition-strats.27701/
to check out what he calls the "infamous Kawai hole". In other words, something about the musictrade.jp timeline may not be quite right, it could be that Kawai made, or painted and assembled Fernandes guitars until 1981 (not 1978) and even beyond. To prove the opposite, it would be necessary to find a (definitely) Matsumoku-made Strat copy from the same time period showing this hole but the only Aria I could find showing a hole with surrounding indentations was more recently made in China. I think only letting time pass to find more pictures of neck pockets will help clearing this up.
 
Same hole and 4 impressions yet a different control cavity route. Mine is angled whereas the other runs in a straight line. I wonder if this body with the straight control cavity was for a Jeff beck model. It would make sense as the 3 micro switches were running that way above and in line with the volume control.
 

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I'm in a rush right now so I can't research but here are some pages about fernandes I translated from a Japan Vintage Book that should be informative. They mention the copper cavity shielding on paqe 27. Sweet guitar!
We've kinda established it a Kawai-built FST-60 BYS from 1980. The hanger hole in the neck pocket is the Kawai giveaway. The rest is pretty obvious from the lengthy post translated from the catologue by Sigmania on the first page.
 
We've kinda established it a Kawai-built
Whoa, hold on a minute... :) What I was trying to say is that (to me) there are indications that it could be still Kawai, however the jury is still out on that, more evidence (particularly trying to find out what other factories used drilled-through holes their neck pockets) is needed.

here are some pages about fernandes I translated from a Japan Vintage Book that should be informative. They mention the copper cavity shielding on paqe 27.

Great stuff, thanks! I wish there would be more translated materials from Japan! :)
 
We've kinda established it a Kawai-built FST-60 BYS from 1980. The hanger hole in the neck pocket is the Kawai giveaway. The rest is pretty obvious from the lengthy post translated from the catologue by Sigmania on the first page.
Just figured you would be interested in some of the info in there buddy. :)
 
Whoa, hold on a minute... :) What I was trying to say is that (to me) there are indications that it could be still Kawai, however the jury is still out on that, more evidence (particularly trying to find out what other factories used drilled-through holes their neck pockets) is needed.



Great stuff, thanks! I wish there would be more translated materials from Japan! :)
First we would need to know exactly how many factories Fernandes sub contracted to. For all we know some could have been subbed out to some smaller guitar builders as a favour or to keep up with orders.

Remember 1980-81 was another transitional period In the world of guitars. Metal was becoming more popular. pointy guitars were in.

They could have been re-tooling for other models around that time. I don't think it really matters. It's just a hole for a hook when they were painting. I think? Can't see why else it would be there.

I do appreciate everyone's input and if you do find out where it was made please feel free to update this thread. I'll keep looking myself.

Thanks again everyone
ps, for what it's worth. I don't have the guitar in my possession as of now. I'm still waiting on it being shipped from the land of the rising Sun, so I have no clue if that neck pocket hole goes all the way through, though I don't see why it wouldn't if it was used to hang the guitar during painting.

pps, And those four indentations intrigue me though. clamp marks or stamps?

ppps, And that G string is off-center in the saddle and it's bugging me. That will be the first thing that gets resolved when it gets here...in December 😀
 
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I had a quick look through this thread and found some stuff to comment on. If I missed something and managed to add something already established, I'm sorry. I'll give it a detailed read-through later and see if I missed something.

First off, the neck-stamp is a date, Jan 23 1980 in this case. The same format is used for a long time (I believe?) into the Revival era. To keep things interesting, the date is sometimes reversed, from right to left, with the year given in the Japanese Imperial calendar format (53 = Showa 53 = 53rd year of Hirohitos reign = 1978 etc). I've had a FMT-40 stone logo Mustang copy with that date format - which kept me awake at night for a while. :cool:

So far, I've seen no other manufacturer using the fifth hole through the neck pocket for what appears to be paint shop handling purposes. It's quite specific, very coarse on the outside (i e under the neckplate) and to my mind a good manufacturer tell. I very much doubt that they would change the paint shop working procedures for a specific customer, especially if the result is invisible in the finished product. I've had several of Aria Pro IIs final generation of Matsu-made Strat copies from the same period, and they didn't have the 5th hole.
That Kawai made the bulk of Fernandes Fender copies from the spaghetti logo era and through the 80's has been accepted as fact for a while now, afaik. We all know how dangerous that can be, but personally I'm inclined to accept it. For one thing, there's an interesting 1990's interview with Fender's Dan Smith, in which he talks about the run-up to the formation of Fender Japan, and he states that Fender "talked to Kawai, who were making guitars for Fernandes", something that should have happened during 1981. I reckon he would know, and it's about as solid a piece of evidence I've seen so far, in lieu of official documentation. Since Fernandes Fender copies had the fifth hole at that time and for several years afterwards, I would assume that they remained with Kawai for at least most of the 80s.
The interview is here, and a good read all around:

Interview: Fender Visionary Dan Smith on How to Turn Around a Faltering Guitar Brand | Bacon's Archive

Re: the L5002T pickups: they're copies of Schecter F500Ts, as found in the Schecter "Dream Machine" Strats, which the FST-90 and -150 copied. They're tappable pickups with two coils, one inside the other. I have a couple of them, I've never had them installed in anything, but they measure around 6k with one coil and just over 12k with both.
Greco had a similar pickup (though hotter, 9k/16k), the SE-1T. I have two undocumented pre-JV 1982 SE-600s (still with model stickers) with them and the same control setup as the FSTs, i e with two push-pull pots, volume and tone. I haven't played them in a while, but as i recall, one pot kicks in the second coil in the bridge and neck pickups while the second one activates the middle pickups when the five-way hasn't already. Complex? Yeah, like a combination lock, basically, 15 tones in total. And weird, there's a setting when both coils in the bridge pickup and one coil in the middle pickup becomes the world's muddiest 23k humbucker. Interesting stuff.
As far as I know, Schecter used the same setup, so I would assume that the FSTs did too. Not sure, though.
 
Who manufactured those?

Good finds! The first one is particularly interesting because it sports the spaghetti logo and the elongated neck plate, both generally attributed to Kawai but it shows the 5-digit number scheme, the same arrangement of what you call the "hanger hole" and the small nail hole we saw on the guitar you're waiting for. The carcass in the second link lacks the neck plate/serial but the (HH, 22F) features would fit the era. This seems to point a lot to Kawai.

Meanwhile I also found a definitely Matsumoku-made "Westone" Strat copy saying "Matsumoku" on the neck plate, it doesn't show the neck pocket but the PU routings are quite different.

Edit, I just saw voidoid56 commented, well, the evidence indications that Kawai did not stop making Fernandes after the spaghetti logo era is quite massive.
 
I had a quick look through this thread and found some stuff to comment on. If I missed something and managed to add something already established, I'm sorry. I'll give it a detailed read-through later and see if I missed something.

First off, the neck-stamp is a date, Jan 23 1980 in this case. The same format is used for a long time (I believe?) into the Revival era. To keep things interesting, the date is sometimes reversed, from right to left, with the year given in the Japanese Imperial calendar format (53 = Showa 53 = 53rd year of Hirohitos reign = 1978 etc). I've had a FMT-40 stone logo Mustang copy with that date format - which kept me awake at night for a while. :cool:

So far, I've seen no other manufacturer using the fifth hole through the neck pocket for what appears to be paint shop handling purposes. It's quite specific, very coarse on the outside (i e under the neckplate) and to my mind a good manufacturer tell. I very much doubt that they would change the paint shop working procedures for a specific customer, especially if the result is invisible in the finished product. I've had several of Aria Pro IIs final generation of Matsu-made Strat copies from the same period, and they didn't have the 5th hole.
That Kawai made the bulk of Fernandes Fender copies from the spaghetti logo era and through the 80's has been accepted as fact for a while now, afaik. We all know how dangerous that can be, but personally I'm inclined to accept it. For one thing, there's an interesting 1990's interview with Fender's Dan Smith, in which he talks about the run-up to the formation of Fender Japan, and he states that Fender "talked to Kawai, who were making guitars for Fernandes", something that should have happened during 1981. I reckon he would know, and it's about as solid a piece of evidence I've seen so far, in lieu of official documentation. Since Fernandes Fender copies had the fifth hole at that time and for several years afterwards, I would assume that they remained with Kawai for at least most of the 80s.
The interview is here, and a good read all around:

Interview: Fender Visionary Dan Smith on How to Turn Around a Faltering Guitar Brand | Bacon's Archive

Re: the L5002T pickups: they're copies of Schecter F500Ts, as found in the Schecter "Dream Machine" Strats, which the FST-90 and -150 copied. They're tappable pickups with two coils, one inside the other. I have a couple of them, I've never had them installed in anything, but they measure around 6k with one coil and just over 12k with both.
Greco had a similar pickup (though hotter, 9k/16k), the SE-1T. I have two undocumented pre-JV 1982 SE-600s (still with model stickers) with them and the same control setup as the FSTs, i e with two push-pull pots, volume and tone. I haven't played them in a while, but as i recall, one pot kicks in the second coil in the bridge and neck pickups while the second one activates the middle pickups when the five-way hasn't already. Complex? Yeah, like a combination lock, basically, 15 tones in total. And weird, there's a setting when both coils in the bridge pickup and one coil in the middle pickup becomes the world's muddiest 23k humbucker. Interesting stuff.
As far as I know, Schecter used the same setup, so I would assume that the FSTs did too. Not sure, though.
Thanks for this reply. Excellent post.

From what i've read here and elsewhere in the past few days it appears Fernandes was aiming to draw in the LP/Humbucker fans with the 22frets and meatier L5992T pickups in their Strats long before Fender even thought about it. Which I find pretty awesome.
 
And those four indentations intrigue me though. clamp marks or stamps?
The 1983 carcass link looks like these are from Phillips screws arranged around a jig with the drill bit in the middle. Re "hanger hole" - the chipped areas around the hole look like the holes were drilled after the finish was applied and cured?
 
The 1983 carcass link looks like these are from Phillips screws arranged around a jig with the drill bit in the middle. Re "hanger hole" - the chipped areas around the hole look like the holes were drilled after the finish was applied and cured?
Drilled badly. I take it they never thought of using a pilot drill or tape to stop tear-out. Hey, everyone has a bad day at work or we've all come across that one guy who was just hopeless at everything but the management felt sorry for him. 😕
 
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